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Old 07-03-2009, 12:48 PM   #11 (permalink)
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I was thinking out loud. Sometime so loud I have to use ear plugs to hear myself.
I was a math and physics major but took a couple of EE course on basic electronics, which I used much more in work than my physics.

I am trying to pull out cob webs and remember what increases dynamic range in an amplifier. The one thing I remember is if you increase the delta of the rail voltages, the amp will have more dynamic range. I know it works with transistors and tubes. I used to build HF amps power supplies with as much voltage as I thought the tube could stand. This not only gave more power, but more dynamic range.

There are probably other designs and the devices themselves that have different ranges.

The one thing the Winegard HDP-269 doesn't have is an FM trap. I tend toward recommending the AP-8700. It has a lot of dynamic range and an FM trap.

The one thing you have to watch on HDP-269 (besides living next to an FM station) is enough gain in a large house with multiple TVs. 100ft of RG6 good and new is about 5db on the upper channels. A 4 way splitter that is well made approaches 7db at best.
That is cutting it close is someone has 50 ft to the splitter and 50 to a remote TV in the basement for example. I am sure you know, but for the benefit of others, once you use up all the gain in the amp, noise starts building up quickly.

I am thinking out loud again, so ear plugs required by OSHA... If you read this article that someone over at AVS turned me on to Testing for DTV Interference, by Charles W. Rhodes you can see, FM may be a bigger problem than apparent. So FM trap ahead of the amp is a good idea.

The 8700 is -21 or so dbm and the 269 is -14 dbm, which gives the 269 much more dynamic range, but again no FM trap.

I boils down to a well engineered home system, is the only way to go. However the concepts and math involved are beyond or unknown to 99% of the DYI OTA antenna installers.

I have to say the combo vs separate switch on the CM7777 is darn handy if you are experimenting.
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Old 07-14-2009, 03:04 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Great stuff from Piggie and DonM.

There are lots of good amps out there.

2 Ive recently discovered and I have one are....

Motorola BDA-S1 (and S2 and S4 - number indicates number of outputs)

Its a bi directional amp for cable modem usage, GasFet low noise less than 2db)

and the

Kitz Technologies KT-100VG

Quote:
The KT-100VG is a variable gain broadband low noise amplifier for television. It is designed to improve reception on HDTV, UHF, VHF and FM channels. The KT-100VG is designed with state of the art circuitry which combines extremely low noise and low distortion for superb reception. Because of its very low noise figure, it can give mast-mounted performance from inside the house. The KT-100VG also provides a variable gain control to give you just the right amount of signal for your system. Many amplifiers on the market today have too much gain, too much noise and way too much distortion
Quote:
Bandwidth 40 Mhz - 1000Mhz
Noise Figure: 1 db or less across the band
Gain: Adjustable from 0 - 20 db
Output IP3: >+32dbm
Input/Output Impedance: 75 ohms
Diecast Aluminum Case
DC power supply included
Warranty: 1 Year
Although I think the variable gain cuts the signal coming in.


Other good choices for brands of amps to look for are....

Pico Macom
Channel Plus
Jerrold
Blonder Tongue

and of course...

Channel Master
Winegard
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Old 07-14-2009, 04:18 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Because of its very low noise figure, it can give mast-mounted performance from inside the house.
Still mast mounting is the best. Why so many people I have met during the transition will go to all odds and work not to mast mount an amp baffles me.

I doubt I will buy any more Channel Master 7777. Though its a great amp with dynamic range beyond it's specifications, Winegard makes amps in the 20 db with just as much dynamic range with mast mounts and made in the USA.
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Old 07-14-2009, 04:51 PM   #14 (permalink)
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...I doubt I will buy any more Channel Master 7777. Though its a great amp with dynamic range beyond it's specifications, Winegard makes amps in the 20 db with just as much dynamic range with mast mounts and made in the USA.
I agree. No more ChannelMaster purchases for me, either.
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Old 07-14-2009, 05:00 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Yeah its not mast mountable, but Im thinking of checking one out for Indoor Use.

But I agree with your mast mount comments.
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Old 07-14-2009, 05:59 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Yeah its not mast mountable, but Im thinking of checking one out for Indoor Use.

But I agree with your mast mount comments.
Keep forgetting I am talking to the Ayatollah of Indoor.

Mast head is indoors on an indoor antenna! Actually one probably needs about 3 db of gain to over come any possible extension or connector loss. It's the low noise figure that kicks the llama's ass....
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