Piggie

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The more I understand, the less I know.

Wheezer

The only thing different with the nanny-state VCR is a "non-defeatable" AGC circuit, to my understanding. This allows noise to be inserted into the vertical blanking interval of the source material that will confuse the recorder.

Piggie

Ok, so if I put an NTSC baseband signal into the composite inputs, then before it records it inserts noise during vertical blanking? If it does that some NTSC TV's won't lock on the vertical sync tips if the noise gets too close to same level as vertical sync.

I am am still confused of what use these new VCRs are if they do that to every recording. What if I put my own camera into the composite input, does it still noise up vertical blanking? If so that is total cra-p.

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The more I understand, the less I know.

Wheezer

The VCRs don't inject the signal, they're just mandated to respond to it [17 USC section 1201(k)(1) et seq.]. Apparently, some DVD players will inject Macrovision copy protection as an output stage; I don't know how common this is, but I assume the instruction comes from the disc rather than being a generic feature. (And that it's the reason people are advised not to daisy-chain DVD->VCR.)

Piggie

Now that sequence makes sense. The copy protection comes out of the DVD player, not in the VCR. Noise in vertical blanking while trying to record would mess everything up. If an analog tape machine can't lock to vertical blanking, it can't record.

Now that said, if the VCR goes to modulate the signal out of DVD, I can't see how it would mess up the RF modulator to the TV.

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The more I understand, the less I know.

1inxs

I hope this post doesn't mislead the OP. You cannot connect to the VCR with out going through a separate RF converter. The copy protection has been on every VCR since they rolled off the assembly line in 1975. Nothing has changed.
Connecting Both a DVD Recorder and a VCR to a Television - Adding a DVD Recorder to Your Current Television - VCR Setup or Home Theater System

Piggie

Ok, well it has worked here for years with various setups and various VCRs I have owned, granted the newest one is vintage of the early 1990s.

I think it all depends on how well the TV can deal with the noise in the vertical interval

I remember when the copy protection first hit I rented VCR tapes that would not play without messing tracking. I asked my buddy Duane at work (we did digital video production way back in late 70's) and he said just play with the tracking and at some point you will create enough vertical sync to lock the TV (TV's then also had V-holds also).

But I have run DVD's through my VCR, game consoles. I have set up friends that way and it worked.

Don't know. another case of googling links won't change what I have done.

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The more I understand, the less I know.

1inxs

I agree with that. The copy protection is produced in the DVD and VHF media. There are a limited quantity of DVDs produced without copy protection. I believe all DVD players pass the copy protection through the outputs. Few, if any, upconverting DVD players, are able to send out an upconverted signal through the composite or component outputs, due to the copy protection. Most require the output through an HDMI for the upconverted signal. I'm sure video games and satellite receiver signals could be viewed without an RF modulator, but it's highly unlikely a DVD player would work without one, unless the DVD was one of the few without copy protection.