Reception in the NW

KevinNW

DTVUSA Rookie
#1
Greetings from the NW.

I am trying to get a handle on what I might need to increase my reception to get two VHF channels, KCTS-DT (9) and KSTW (11).

With a set of rabbit ears and some patience, I am able to get every channel listed on my TVFOOL in the green and yellow, but lacking the two above. I recently bought this antenna and mounted it indoors. I could live with this for the UHF, but still no 9 or 11. I plan on returning this antenna -- although it says it picks up HI-VHF, it's not working for me.

I realize that I might need a different solution (i.e. not an indoor setup) to get these VHF channels and hopefully boost my UHF. Channel 9 is the lowest VHF I am trying to get. I have the option of mounting outdoors on a pole, or as a last resort, on the roof. I cannot use the attic.

There has been some pub here in the NW about the change of KCTS from UHF to VHF. A lot of people can't get KCTS. For those interested, here is what KCTS is suggesting.

I would appreciate any feedback from the great people here in this forum about potential setups. Also, I would love to hear what anyone is the NW is doing to get KCTS.

Here is my TVFOOL for reference.


Thanks!

KEVIN
 

Jason Fritz

Administrator
Staff member
#2

Piggie

Super Moderator
#3
Greetings from the NW.

I am trying to get a handle on what I might need to increase my reception to get two VHF channels, KCTS-DT (9) and KSTW (11).

With a set of rabbit ears and some patience, I am able to get every channel listed on my TVFOOL in the green and yellow, but lacking the two above. I recently bought this antenna and mounted it indoors. I could live with this for the UHF, but still no 9 or 11. I plan on returning this antenna -- although it says it picks up HI-VHF, it's not working for me.

I realize that I might need a different solution (i.e. not an indoor setup) to get these VHF channels and hopefully boost my UHF. Channel 9 is the lowest VHF I am trying to get. I have the option of mounting outdoors on a pole, or as a last resort, on the roof. I cannot use the attic.

There has been some pub here in the NW about the change of KCTS from UHF to VHF. A lot of people can't get KCTS. For those interested, here is what KCTS is suggesting.

I would appreciate any feedback from the great people here in this forum about potential setups. Also, I would love to hear what anyone is the NW is doing to get KCTS.

Here is my TVFOOL for reference.


Thanks!

KEVIN
What would be good is if you did the TVFool again with the height you plan to use outdoors. I tried you truncated coordinates and you are in a hilly enough location exact coordinates are critical.

However judging from 5 ft you have enough signal to work with.

I was trying to figure a solution that should work without a rotor.
It's possible to use 7694P pointed at 9, 11 and there should be enough signal from the UHF's to work even though they are off axis.
Winegard HD 7694P High Definition VHF/UHF HDHD769 Series Antenna (HD7694P) | HD7694P [Winegard]

I am concerned if you go to a higher gain antenna it will be too narrow or directional to pull in the UHFs.

I would need to see your TVFool plot at 10 to 15 ft up to see if you could run a preamp.

Also are you splitting the signal to more than one TV?

===========

Sorry you found out the hard way the marketing on the Clearstream2 is somewhat deceptive. Hope you can return it.
 

KevinNW

DTVUSA Rookie
#4
Jay:

Yeah! I had noticed your on article on the NW after I joined and posted. You are tracking this all over the country. Great work. Mounting height would be around 10 feet with a pretty clear LOS. If antenna size is too large and makes that awkward, I will head to the roof which is probably 30 or so.

I'm learning that this will likely be a little trial and error (I have already returned one antenna). I was originally thinking that I didn't want to buy "too much antenna" for what I need. Is that even possible?

I've read this forum for the last few days and have learned a ton already.

Thanks!!

K
 

KevinNW

DTVUSA Rookie
#5
What would be good is if you did the TVFool again with the height you plan to use outdoors. I tried you truncated coordinates and you are in a hilly enough location exact coordinates are critical.

However judging from 5 ft you have enough signal to work with.

I was trying to figure a solution that should work without a rotor.
It's possible to use 7694P pointed at 9, 11 and there should be enough signal from the UHF's to work even though they are off axis.
Winegard HD 7694P High Definition VHF/UHF HDHD769 Series Antenna (HD7694P) | HD7694P [Winegard]

I am concerned if you go to a higher gain antenna it will be too narrow or directional to pull in the UHFs.

I would need to see your TVFool plot at 10 to 15 ft up to see if you could run a preamp.

Also are you splitting the signal to more than one TV?

===========

Sorry you found out the hard way the marketing on the Clearstream2 is somewhat deceptive. Hope you can return it.
Great info. You are right, it is hilly -- hopefully high enough ground if Mt. Rainier ever plans on blowing up. I like the idea of not having a rotor. I would not be splitting the signal and would imagine that I wouldn't need too much coaxial -- like under 30 feet. I am running into a Samsung with a internal tuner.

Here is an updated TVFOOL.

Thanks again!

K
 

Piggie

Super Moderator
#6
Great info. You are right, it is hilly -- hopefully high enough ground if Mt. Rainier ever plans on blowing up. I like the idea of not having a rotor. I would not be splitting the signal and would imagine that I wouldn't need too much coaxial -- like under 30 feet. I am running into a Samsung with a internal tuner.

Here is an updated TVFOOL.

Thanks again!

K
Your signals are low enough an small amp would insure two things. One is all the signal captured by the antenna is preserved down the coax. Moreover this little amp and not expensive Winegard HDP 269 SquareShooter Pre-Amplifier for SquareShooter SS-1000 (HDP-269) | HDP-269 [Winegard] is a 3db noise figure, probably lower than your TV.

I feel 80% sure that the Winegard 7694P is wide enough beam to grab all your UHF. Nothing in antennas is ever 100% unless you live under the tower.

I would check with a local Lowes to buy your pole, coax and house bracket. Radio Shack has them, normally a higher price.

Be sure if you buy the above combo, to buy a short jumper between the antenna and the amp (which you mount under the antenna) so no more than 5 feet (short but if you need a rotor you will need 5 feet). Then a piece to get in the house. Make sure it's RG6. Quad shield with an amp won't make any difference.

Also you should have a ground. If you put one of these.
Winegard GB-8100 Single Grounding Block for Coaxial Cable (GB-8100) | GB-8100 [Winegard]
on the wall where it goes in the house. Buy a piece of 10 gauge copper to run from the ground block to a ground rod. The ground rod can be found at Lowes or Radio Shack.

Make sure you put a drip loop in the coax, so any rain drips off the coax and doens't run right into a connector.

Antenna Basics
then scroll down to "Grounding outdoor antennas" to see a typical installation.

If you can handle a drill, screwdriver and wrench you are home.
 

KevinNW

DTVUSA Rookie
#7
Your signals are low enough an small amp would insure two things. One is all the signal captured by the antenna is preserved down the coax. Moreover this little amp and not expensive Winegard HDP 269 SquareShooter Pre-Amplifier for SquareShooter SS-1000 (HDP-269) | HDP-269 [Winegard] is a 3db noise figure, probably lower than your TV.

I feel 80% sure that the Winegard 7694P is wide enough beam to grab all your UHF. Nothing in antennas is ever 100% unless you live under the tower.

I would check with a local Lowes to buy your pole, coax and house bracket. Radio Shack has them, normally a higher price.

Be sure if you buy the above combo, to buy a short jumper between the antenna and the amp (which you mount under the antenna) so no more than 5 feet (short but if you need a rotor you will need 5 feet). Then a piece to get in the house. Make sure it's RG6. Quad shield with an amp won't make any difference.

Also you should have a ground. If you put one of these.
Winegard GB-8100 Single Grounding Block for Coaxial Cable (GB-8100) | GB-8100 [Winegard]
on the wall where it goes in the house. Buy a piece of 10 gauge copper to run from the ground block to a ground rod. The ground rod can be found at Lowes or Radio Shack.

Make sure you put a drip loop in the coax, so any rain drips off the coax and doens't run right into a connector.

Antenna Basics
then scroll down to "Grounding outdoor antennas" to see a typical installation.

If you can handle a drill, screwdriver and wrench you are home.
Great info. If I were to mount on the roof and run more coax, do you recommend a different amp?
 

Piggie

Super Moderator
#8
Great info. If I were to mount on the roof and run more coax, do you recommend a different amp?
That particular amp is 12 db. db is a scale like inches or pounds, etc that can just be added and subtracted.

100 ft of even cheap RG6 new has at the most 6 db of loss over 100 ft on the UHF channels and maybe as high as 3 db on VHF channels

Hence that amp has enough power to run about 150 ft of RG6 coax with no splitter in the line. With a 2 way splitter about 100 ft. With a 4 way splitter about 75 ft. Those are conservative estimates by 10 to 20 percent.

So not splitting and even if in the future you add a two way splitter, it will have plenty of power.
 
Top